Well what do you think vote in the poll and post your reasoning.

OMFG... dude... He cares about his fans a lot! :O!!!
How could anyone say he doesn't?
He keeps us in constant suspense and wonder!

Of course he does! Why would he reform the Smashing Pumpkins in the first place? He could easily create another band, perhaps with members of the original Pumpkins, that would be just as large of a commercial success as any new Pumpkins album would be, or would be just as "fulfilling" for his soul. Of course it's for the fans!

I say he cares a lot.

A couple reasons:

1.) He gave us Machina II for free. FREE!
2.) He went on the TFE tour and made almost nothing from the tour(all the setup was expensive, etc). He said he did the tour for us.
3.) When djali zwan came to grand rapids ticket demand was really high and this was his first time back since the pumpkins demise. So, for us fans, he decided to play 2 shows in one night so that more people could see him and the band play.
4.) He did the fan meetup not to long ago. For no reason other than saying hi to the fans.
5.) He has released tons and tons of bootleg material for us with no expectation of repayment.
6.) For the farewell tour he was not charging typical 'Farewell tour' prices. You all know the stories of Kiss and the rolling stones gouging their fans wallets.

i think he just cares about not pissing off the fans

The reason why he returned to a rockier sound on Machina is because he thought the fans would prefer it.

Here is a story I heard from one of my friends about Billy. During the time Zwan was together, my buddy was in New York and had gotten a ticket to see them play. Hours before the show, he went into a CD shop and happened to come across Billy. He wasn't sure if he should approach him or not but he did (which would be annoying for BC but I am sure most of us would if we got the chance). Anyway he told Billy he was going to the show, loved him, the Pumpkins, etc. Billy never looked up at him. My friend then asked if he would sign his ticket, which Billy then took and looked at for a while without even looking at my friend. Finally, Billy signed the ticket, but on the end that the ushers take when they tear your ticket in half. He purposely wrote on the end that my friend couldn't keep. He begged the usher to let him keep it but they wouldn't. Anyway, read into that as you like Pumpkin lovers.

pugman link=topic=684.msg10138#msg10138 date=1162156147]
Of course he does! Why would he reform the Smashing Pumpkins in the first place? He could easily create another band, perhaps with members of the original Pumpkins, that would be just as large of a commercial success as any new Pumpkins album would be, or would be just as "fulfilling" for his soul. Of course it's for the fans!


Actually, I would have thought he was reforming the Pumpkins because he hasn't managed success since they split. If he could so easily make a brand new band and be successful like SP then how come TFE was such a flop? This is his best way of getting back in the limelight. Of course it might backfire badly if he doesn't start making good music like he used to.

I do think he cares about the fans though. He's not stupid; he knows he's nobody without the fans.

social31 link=topic=684.msg10144#msg10144 date=1162164806]
Here is a story I heard from one of my friends about Billy. During the time Zwan was together, my buddy was in New York and had gotten a ticket to see them play. Hours before the show, he went into a CD shop and happened to come across Billy. He wasn't sure if he should approach him or not but he did (which would be annoying for BC but I am sure most of us would if we got the chance). Anyway he told Billy he was going to the show, loved him, the Pumpkins, etc. Billy never looked up at him. My friend then asked if he would sign his ticket, which Billy then took and looked at for a while without even looking at my friend. Finally, Billy signed the ticket, but on the end that the ushers take when they tear your ticket in half. He purposely wrote on the end that my friend couldn't keep. He begged the usher to let him keep it but they wouldn't. Anyway, read into that as you like Pumpkin lovers.

Awwww, that's sad, what if it was a Billy Corgan look-alike? Or maybe your friend made up the story ust to piss you off and make you quit forcing him to listen to SP everywhere.

And as to his commercial success, SP's success was diminishing as less and less people began to care. If SP was as popular before their breakup as duning Siamese Dream and Mellon Collie, I think Zwan would also have been very successful, but nobody cared anymore, the music audience had moved on to new styles of music, like nu-metal . The new album might sell better than Machina, but it won't be another Mellon Collie, at least commercial wise.

pugman link=topic=684.msg10152#msg10152 date=1162168155]
And as to his commercial success, SP's success was diminishing as less and less people began to care. If SP was as popular before their breakup as duning Siamese Dream and Mellon Collie, I think Zwan would also have been very successful, but nobody cared anymore, the music audience had moved on to new styles of music, like nu-metal . The new album might sell better than Machina, but it won't be another Mellon Collie, at least commercial wise.


I would say SP's commercial success went down because the quality of their music did. Adore was a very different style - still an awesome record - but I can see how casual fans could be put off.
And then came Machina. A very weak record by the Pumpkins standards and an average record in general. Not helped by the awful production.
The Zwan music was average, nothing special. And the same with TFE.
I'm presuming Billy exhausted all his creativity by the end of Adore. Or maybe he just stopped trying.
But hopefully the break from SP and the huge decline in interest in his work will give him the kick he needs.

social31 link=topic=684.msg10144#msg10144 date=1162164806]
Here is a story I heard from one of my friends about Billy. During the time Zwan was together, my buddy was in New York and had gotten a ticket to see them play. Hours before the show, he went into a CD shop and happened to come across Billy. He wasn't sure if he should approach him or not but he did (which would be annoying for BC but I am sure most of us would if we got the chance). Anyway he told Billy he was going to the show, loved him, the Pumpkins, etc. Billy never looked up at him. My friend then asked if he would sign his ticket, which Billy then took and looked at for a while without even looking at my friend. Finally, Billy signed the ticket, but on the end that the ushers take when they tear your ticket in half. He purposely wrote on the end that my friend couldn't keep. He begged the usher to let him keep it but they wouldn't. Anyway, read into that as you like Pumpkin lovers.

holy smokes, if that ever happened to me, id be like, "hey asshole! sign it on this other part!" lmao, jk, id just tell him off and sell my ticket, i sure hope that was true, then it means im right

social31 link=topic=684.msg10144#msg10144 date=1162164806]
Here is a story I heard from one of my friends about Billy. During the time Zwan was together, my buddy was in New York and had gotten a ticket to see them play. Hours before the show, he went into a CD shop and happened to come across Billy. He wasn't sure if he should approach him or not but he did (which would be annoying for BC but I am sure most of us would if we got the chance). Anyway he told Billy he was going to the show, loved him, the Pumpkins, etc. Billy never looked up at him. My friend then asked if he would sign his ticket, which Billy then took and looked at for a while without even looking at my friend. Finally, Billy signed the ticket, but on the end that the ushers take when they tear your ticket in half. He purposely wrote on the end that my friend couldn't keep. He begged the usher to let him keep it but they wouldn't. Anyway, read into that as you like Pumpkin lovers.


Maybe he sensed that your friend wasn't genuine?

epitome link=topic=684.msg10158#msg10158 date=1162175278]
I would say SP's commercial success went down because the quality of their music did.

It's not the quality of the music that went down, it's the mass appeal. As I said, nobody really cared anymore because it didn't fit in with current music trends, so as you said, casual fans were turned away. Siamese Dream was a success because it was, somewhat, a grunge record in a time when grunge was popular. In fact, I would say that the quality of the music went up because Billy followed his evolving musical passions rather than continuing with what the public wanted to hear. But I agree, that hopefully the excitement over the new album and 6 years worth of ideas will produce a very wonderful thing.

I second that, Pugman.

Well guys, I agree with Pugman...in the early part of their career you could lump the pumpkins up into a genre some called them "alternative" and some called them "grunge." Billy has stated that he never wanted the band to be known for one style of music so with MCIS he tried to incapsulate everything that the band was already known for with one double C.D. so that afterwards they could venture into other musical rhelms -The reason for the change Billy has said is that the band didn't want to keep being the same band they were but would rather show a different side of the band with each album. Thus we have Adore witch in my opinion just as good as the other material but not easily labelled. When record companies don't know what to label something they don't know how to market it. Adore didn't sell as well as MCIS but even still they did a full tour and DONATED the funds to local charities - that's definitely caring about the fans - how many other bands have done that???

Shame link=topic=684.msg10143#msg10143 date=1162158058]
The reason why he returned to a rockier sound on Machina is because he thought the fans would prefer it.


Yes, and of course machina was "rockier"...they got the best rock drummer in the world back in the band!!! Also, Machina was different because they blended the heavy rock stuff of old with the newer electronic sound they had started using on Adore. I felt Machina was an excellent album but probably a little too experimental for most others who bash it.

Anyone waiting for ANOTHER MCIS or Machina for that matter can hang it up...they have already proven that they will stay innovative even if it means losing money...if that doesn't show that they care about their "DIE HARD" fans I don't know what does.

pugman link=topic=684.msg10163#msg10163 date=1162182748]
epitome link=topic=684.msg10158#msg10158 date=1162175278]
I would say SP's commercial success went down because the quality of their music did.

It's not the quality of the music that went down, it's the mass appeal. As I said, nobody really cared anymore because it didn't fit in with current music trends, so as you said, casual fans were turned away. Siamese Dream was a success because it was, somewhat, a grunge record in a time when grunge was popular. In fact, I would say that the quality of the music went up because Billy followed his evolving musical passions rather than continuing with what the public wanted to hear. But I agree, that hopefully the excitement over the new album and 6 years worth of ideas will produce a very wonderful thing.


Well, I wouldn't call myself a casual fan, and I think the quality of the music on Machina was much lower than on any previous album. And the production was terrible - the Machina songs generally sound much better live because they don't have that fuzzy distortion all over them.
As for Zwan and TFE, I really can't see how anyone could consider it amazing music. I have the albums, I think they're ok, but nothing many other artists couldn't match.
I guess it many ways it just depends what you think sounds good, but in my opinion after Adore Corgan's work plunged.

He cares, but it is impossible to accommodate each and every single person. And he's smart enough to know that if you try to please everyone, you wind up pleasing no one.
So Billy's options are:
1. To focus on what he himself wants his music to be
2. To be himself, which is to be only human
3. To hope people can understand that