...is pretty much just Billy & Jimmy." - from the man himself, it's official!

So, do we think that James/D'arcy had any input with the sound of the band? Did they just provide quality control?

Is Billy spouting BS just to make his new band sell (using the SP brand name)?

If not, is Adore a SP album? Is MSOTS a SP album?

Personnally, I hear Adore as more of a Billy solo album!

Lets just hope that on the next album, the other members at least have a say on the artwork, coz the cover aside, Zeitgeist is terrible! It looks like it was put together by an 18 year old, for an art project!

I know that this is a discussion that has been had before, but we now have it from the horses mouth!

If you care, discuss!

I care but this discussion has been raised so many times I just can't be bothered with it anymore...

It is indeed a conversation we've had before!

The fact that Billy is saying this means little in the face of all of the fans who believed it, previously.

I think everyone here knows my opinion, but, in case you don't, I'll be concise: no member of the Smashing Pumpkins, past or present, have ever been negligible. Some have been more important than others (i.e. BC/JC), but, given the nature of the band and their music, this is unavoidable. A rock group can survive without an astounding bassist and second guitarist. A rock band cannot, however, survive without a dynamic frontman or an energetic drummer.

Honestly, though? All you really need for an SP album is Billy Corgan and a genuine desire to make Smashing music.

I think we pretty much all knew that. There's been stories that even in the recording of siamese dream, james and darcy didn't get to play their own parts. jimmy did the drums, and billy did all the rest. where the difference comes in for me is the live shows. there was such a chemsitry between and on stage that's not quite there now. the live shows now are still great, but part of me misses what they had going before.

in the studio though, billy and jimmy will always be the primary influences.

i never had thought about adore as a billy solo album, but in a way, it is....interesting point.

i miss

Blah Blah Blah....U took a quote straight from the horses mouth huh??? THe same guy that said:

"There's a lot of chemistry in the band that the outside world could never witness. In our band, D'arcy is the moral conscience -- it's really hard to do something if D'arcy thinks its fucked."

"I have always said that if one person leaves, that's the end of the band. I'm not going to carry on with a faux Jimmy or faux D'Arcy. No fucking way."

or

"Once a pumpkin, Always a pumpkin."

Hey - maybe he's telling the truth this time, but Zeitgeist is still mediocre.

Homicidal_llama wrote:
I care but this discussion has been raised so many times I just can't be bothered with it anymore...
Agreed

Believe wrote:
Blah Blah Blah....U took a quote straight from the horses mouth huh??? THe same guy that said:

"There's a lot of chemistry in the band that the outside world could never witness. In our band, D'arcy is the moral conscience -- it's really hard to do something if D'arcy thinks its fucked."

"I have always said that if one person leaves, that's the end of the band. I'm not going to carry on with a faux Jimmy or faux D'Arcy. No fucking way."

or

"Once a pumpkin, Always a pumpkin."

Hey - maybe he's telling the truth this time, but Zeitgeist is still mediocre.

Exactly!! The point is Billy changes his opinions with every different revival of the band. I mean if Jimmy left now he'd still carry on, we all know he would cus he's done it before!!
Anyway, I said I was bored of this topic didn't I? So I'm gonna continue being bored. Adieu.

i highly doubt jimmy would quit though, (knock on wood)

Homicidal_llama wrote:
Believe wrote:
Blah Blah Blah....U took a quote straight from the horses mouth huh??? THe same guy that said:

"There's a lot of chemistry in the band that the outside world could never witness. In our band, D'arcy is the moral conscience -- it's really hard to do something if D'arcy thinks its fucked."

"I have always said that if one person leaves, that's the end of the band. I'm not going to carry on with a faux Jimmy or faux D'Arcy. No fucking way."

or

"Once a pumpkin, Always a pumpkin."

Hey - maybe he's telling the truth this time, but Zeitgeist is still mediocre.

Exactly!! The point is Billy changes his opinions with every different revival of the band. I mean if Jimmy left now he'd still carry on, we all know he would cus he's done it before!!
Anyway, I said I was bored of this topic didn't I? So I'm gonna continue being bored. Adieu.

What can I say? The Pumpkins are a dynamic band, with dynamic members, and a sound that varies vastly from one album to another. You'd really think that most people would catch on to that by now...

There's nothing wrong with a man changing his opinions. Things happen and people change - it's life, and Billy has had 40 years of it in which to change his mind.

Let the record state that, if Jimmy left (and he won't), Billy would disband what we know now as the "Smashing Pumpkins". He carried on with Adore because James and D'arcy were still with him. He would have carried on if only James were with him, I think. As progressive and exploratory as Billy's sound tends to be, it needs an anchor to the past to be genuine Smashing Pumpkins music.

TFE had no anchor to the past, and that is why is ultimately failed. However, that doesn't mean it wasn't a good album...

very true. i love tfe, but it didn't succeed compared mary, star of the sea. (because jimmy was there) there at least needs to be billy and someone else.

I think he's just saying that to counter the "it's not really TSP" allegations.

[quote]TFE had no anchor to the past, and that is why is ultimately failed. However, that doesn't mean it wasn't a good album...[quote]

Well ... to each his own, but I threw away my copy of TFE. I found that album to be barely listenable. I certainly wouldn't have minded if the experiment went well, but the songs came out so drab and half-assed, whether or not they had a link to his SP past or not.

TFE was ok. Walking Shade was good. A couple of other songs were quite good. The rest was ok, but lacked invention.

It took me a while to warm up to TheFutureEmbrace, but I appreciate it more now, even though it doesn't appear too often in my CD cycle.

I don't think Billy would continue on with the Pumpkins if Jimmy left, they get enough criticism as it is now with half the original band, nobody would ever let it go if Billy continued the Pumpkins with Jeff, Ginger and some other drummer. Not that I think Jimmy would be leaving any time soon.

Anyway, yeah Billy is pretty much the creative genius behind the Pumpkins, he always has been and always will be, but that's not to say James, D'arcy and Jimmy never had any influence on each album. I think James contributed a lot creatively and there's a lot of chemistry between Billy and Jimmy that obviously isn't there on Adore.

But no, I don't think Billy's doing this just to move some records and make some money, I might think differently if Jimmy wasn't involved but I think they both generally want to revive the Pumpkins like they have with Zeitgeist, even if they have Ginger and Jeff replacing D'arcy and James on the tour.

epitome wrote:
TFE was ok. Walking Shade was good. A couple of other songs were quite good. The rest was ok, but lacked invention.

very true. mina loy should've been the single. (love walking shade though)

I thought the same thing when I heard the comment, and the same point was brought up here.

As much as we're aware of the records being more or less a one-two person show, 97% is an overexaggeration, I think anyways. Looking back on interviews and rehearsal footage, to say that D'arcy and James played a huge role may be a stretch, but to say they combined only played a 3% role is too little, I say anyways.

Thinking of one interview, the one from Musique Plus, James did say that "we do 30+ overdubs for the songs..." or something along those lines. Just the overdubs alone account for most of the recording process.

Well now I'm just ranting.